Mar 122018

So people are still fighting about Russia meddling in the 2016 election. It seems to be reasonably well established that they did so, though the claim that the Trump campaign colluded with the Russians seems to be based on little more than wishful thinking. Until I see anything better, I’m going to continue with the assumption that the meddling *seemed* to be mostly anti-Hillary because everyone pretty much assumed she was going to win in a landslide, and the goal wasn’t so much getting Trump elected as it was just messing with the US democratic process and sowing internal dissent and strife for the purposes of generally weakening the US. Which is why the meddling continued well after the election.

Now that the requisite virtue signaling is out of the way… Putin tells us that it wasn’t the Russian government but, you know, those wacky Jews.

Trump-Russia: Putin criticised for Jewish ‘election meddling’ remark

In an interview over the weekend, Putin said of those who ran the troll farms and such:

“Maybe they’re not even Russians, but Ukrainians, Tatars, Jews, just with Russian citizenship.”

Now, here’s the thing. Imagine this was in *any* other context. Instead of election meddling, the people involved were, say, bank robbers. Or an acting troupe. Or athletes. Or *anything.* And instead of Russians, they were Americans. Now imagine this statement:

“Maybe they’re not even Americans, but Ukrainians, Tatars, Jews, just with American citizenship.”

Consider: if someone is Ukranian, or Tatar, or Jewish, or Irish, or Mexican, or Nigerian, or Innuit, or Ainu, or Gondorian or Alderaanian, but they have American citizenship… that means they are *American.* So how is it someone can have Russian citizenship but not be a Russian?



 Posted by at 12:08 pm
  • billybob

    First off, the US openly and proudly interfered in Russian elections, not even bothering to hide it:

    Secondly, Putin was being SARCASTIC. He was mocking the Democraps for their Russian conspiracy theories, talking about Jews in the way we would say “Oh hey, maybe your missing sock was stolen by ALIENS”

    • allen

      and the israeli elections..and the brexit…and the scottish referendum..the list goes on.

      honestly, I’d be more worried if the russians..or anyone else..weren’t trying to meddle. because that would mean they had already fixed the results in their favor.

      it’s like if the chinese suddenly stopped trying to hack in to the pentagon’s computers. it’s not that they’ve given up..that means they’ve found a way in and don’t have to try any longer..

    • Brianna

      1) If we didn’t try to hide it, why was it a *secret* story?
      2) Yes, I’m sure Putin was just being sarcastic. After all, there is absolutely no history of world leaders following up harmless cracks about the evil Jooooos with any kind of state-sponsored persecution, so why would we worry when another world leader starts coming up with conspiracy theories?

  • becida

    I recall that this Russia meddling claim started when they said the Russians stole the democrat emails that showed they deck was stacked against Sanders and gave them to Wikileaks. Wikileaks said a democrat staffer who was really unhappy with what Clinton & the democrats were doing gave them the emails.
    The Russian meddling claim was an attempt to overturn the election, one of many.

    • Paul451

      Actually the FBI investigation started because in May 2016 one of Trump’s team got drunk and bragged to an Australian embassy official (a former conservative politician) about the Russians giving hacked material about Clinton to the Trump campaign, following a secret meeting with Russians in London.

      Two months later, when the wikileaks material was published, the Australian official reported it to the FBI. Everything else followed from that investigation.

  • Herp McDerp

    Under the Soviet government, and I think under the current Russian government, there were subordinate “nationalities” — and “Jewish” was one of them. I’m not talking about the component nations of the USSR such as the Ukrainian SSR and the Byelorussian SSR, but of smaller “federal subject republics” within Russia itself (i.e., within the Russian Federation) such as Chechnya. If I recall correctly, the Soviets even established a “Jewish republic” in Siberia, although you didn’t have to live there to have your Soviet nationality listed as Jewish. (I doubt that many people went there voluntarily.)

    So how is it someone can have Russian citizenship but not be a Russian?

    Hmm. There are members of a certain non-Jewish religion who may have been born in the United States and are American citizens but do not accept American values or the American legal system.

    For that matter, we have loyal, patriotic Americans who also take pride in what you might call their sub-nationalities … I’m thinking of Texans in particular.

    • Herp McDerp

      Update: According to Wikipedia

      The Jewish Autonomous Oblast … is a federal subject of Russia in the Russian Far East, bordering Khabarovsk Krai and Amur Oblast in Russia and Heilongjiang province in China. Its administrative center is the town of Birobidzhan. As of the 2010 Census, JAO’s population was 176,558 people, or 0.1% of the total population of Russia. Judaism is practiced by only 0.2% of the population of the JAO.

      Heh. In other words, 353 practicing Jews.

  • Allen Ury

    “American” is an historically modern term that refers to citizenship in a nation in which all its citizens — save for the Native Americans — can trace their ancestry back to European, Asian, African or Latin American origins. “Russian,” on the other hand, refers to a specific ethnic group, native to that area, that also happens to dominate the Russian state. There is a specific Russian language. There is no such language as American. (We speak “English,”) So you can be other than “Russian” (the ethnicity) and still be a citizen of Russia (the state), whereas anyone who has American citizenship is, by definition, “American,” regardless of their ethnicity.